Category: Dating and Relationships
Hey all.
I had an interesting discussion with another user yesterday, talking about soul mates. I'm curious what you all think. Would you ever consider the possibility of finding, "the one?" Do you feel that you have, or may have, potential to have a soul mate?
I feel that it seems a little drastic to consider such. I'm sure we all have close friends, and even committed relationship expepiences, but I can't say I've ever had a soul mate, and I doubt I'd consider somebody a soul mate, though I may love someone.
I think people come in to your life for a purpose. Some people stay there. some people come in just long enough to teach you a lesson or learn something from you and then they're gone. People grow and change. Unfortunately, close friends often grow apart as their goals change over the years. When I was younger, I did believe in a soulmate, but now, I'm more inclined to think that someone might be the right person for you right now, but that same person may not be the right person for you in 30 or 40 years. It all depends on where you are in life. I don't mean what age you are. I mean, if you're having a particular struggle, you might meet someone who knows just how to help you through it. A really close friendship might happen as a result. eventually, the struggle is over, and you find that the two of you are now almost strangers.
I agree with what Anthony said regarding even friendships not being a "forever" thing. it's refreshing, actually, to know someone else doesn't get so hung up on the future, instead, truly enjoying things as they are now.
that being said, I do feel I've had a soul mate. she was like a sister, but what we had was much stronger. her name was TJ, and she just got me, and I her. we both helped each other through tough times, and I'm certain I'll never find love like hers ever again.
I, like Anthony, used to believe that claptrap about there being someone for everyone. however, now, I don't. there may not be a soul mate for everyone, just as there likely isn't "the one" for everyone.
I don't think there's a life-long "one," I think there are many special special that we have the luck of running into in our lives. Almost any relationship can be deep and meaningful so long as we're willing to be actively involved.
I agree with what's been said here. I've had close relationships with people at times in my life but for whatever reason we just grew apart and lost that special connection. So it just depends on how important the relationship is to all parties involved as to whether or not the relationship is worth saving.
I don't think there is someone who is *the one* for anyone, but I also think you can have a commited relationship with one person for the rest of your life if you play your cards right at every single turn. it's just that most of us end up missing a turn along the way. sometimes that missed turn is getting into that relationship in the first place. Other times, it's something else. Now, don't get me wrong. I think we all learn valuable lessons from failed relationships, so a bad judgment doesn't mean you've just ruined the rest of your life. having said that, if there was only one person in this world that is truly right for you, most of us probably would never meet them.
I don't think that you have to play your cards right at every single turn. I interpret that as meaning that as long as you never make a mistake, the relationship will continue...and everyone will err at some point. If both people can acknowledge the issues and discuss them, that's what matters. Sometimes they're fixable, sometimes not. And if not, I think how you then handle the situation is as important as what came before. Don't try to be perfect, but do try.
The last post makes the most sense. I'm not a believer in most of those words like soulmates and the like, things you can't really prove. You just do the best you can with what you got, and we all make mistakes. In a relationship you just need to allow the other person space to be human and make their own mistakes, but don't roll over and play dead either: take your own space and make your own changes unapologetically.
But, I am personally committed to never keeping score, and owning my own shit, nothing else.
That was a great post, Chris. Feeling close enough to someone that you can discuss your mistakes and shortcomings with one another and understand each other is a really neat experience. even if it ends up not working out, there are always valuable lessons to be learned. as I said earlier, I strongly believe that people come in to your life either to teach you something or to learn something from you, and quite possibly, both.
Agreed, chris. But to me, playing your cards right doesn't always mean never making a mistake. sometimes that can mean responding appropriately when a mistake has been made.
I thought that might be the case; I just wanted to mention my viewpoint.
I believe you can find a soul mate, but that it will be special. That person will maybe be forever, or as said in your life only for a season. A mate is what you make of it, and a soul mate can be created if a both people are willing to do it.
Love is changing, but friendship can create love if managed. I think that is what creates your soul mate.
I actually think the concept of "the one" is morethan a little overrated. If people wait around for that perfect someone they'll be waiting around for a very long time.
right. and the only way to know for sure if they are that perfect someone is to see if you end up lasting your whole life with them.
Yes, I agree.
That may not necessarily be a good thing though.
For example: my grandfather's mother stayed with his father her whole life, who was an abusive alcoholic.
That might be more of a generational thing, though. Divorce was frowned upon, so no one got divorced back then. Also, abuse wasn't talked about, or considered wrong, so saying that a person who stayed with an abuser because they thought that person was the one probably isn't a good assumption to make.
I used to get caught up in the notion that everyone has someone in the world who's perfect for them, and I suppose in a way that could be true. The odds of finding that person are slim to none, though, and considering that you can have a healthy and fulfilling relationship regardless of whether you consider the person a soul mate or not, there's no real reason to get bogged down in such emotionally loaded terminology.
Finally, whenever this kind of discussion comes up, I always think of this song.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qnyw4ytoHC4
I agree, that woman had no choices back then, so she could not be held to modern standards. Even now chicks in that situation are usually so dispirited and broken it's a wonder they're still alive in that situation let alone get help or get out. At least the two beaten chicks I have seen were like that.
I've seen that as well. Then of course if you get married in the Catholic church you mayy have problems since they don't recognize divorces or at least some don't from what I've heard. Of course in that situation there is the option of anullment, which unlike divorce doesn't cost anything at least from my own research. At least it doesn't in Idaho.
Yeah, but you can't just go: "O shit! I really fucked that one up. Let's get an annulment". Certain conditions need to be met, hence why it's a quicker process, but more difficult to obtain, at least from what I've heard.
I know. For one thin i believe you have to have been married for at least six months. Ten your spouse has to have a mental disorder or other problem that makes you fear for your own safety. Of course I've also heard that you can actually get a divorce for nothing or at least very little if you're on a fixed income and can show it.
Divorce. That's a conundrum if there was ever one, in my mind. Is there such a thing as a soul Mate? Maybe, maybe not. But I think that if you find someone who is compatible with you, and you really want things to work out and put enough effort into it, you can make it last. Then, in escence, you will be soulmates. Who goes through the hardships of life together, birth of new children, death of relatives, ups and downs together and separately, promotions and losses in the first place, is bound to be a couple of people whose souls are connected on a deep level... If you consciously make an effort to communicate together about these things, to help each other through, to stay on track, then yes, you are with the one you were supposed to be with because you made it that way. Both of You wanted for it to last, to make it together that you no doubt cut through some tough times by each others side. So then, looking back, that's the one. The person who can stick it out with you. So you can't really know whether the one is the one, unless you can look back at it and see the evidence.
Along the same track, like I said, you have to make a conscious effort, a decision to try to be with someone, to make them your life partner. This is what I think a lot of people lack in their relationships. They don't think things through in the beginning, don't make an effort to get to know someone well enough, and then they don't make an effort to stick by their choice. No one's saying that anyone should be miserable. No one's saying that anyone should endure a situation that they shouldnt' be in, but how many people have been in a situation where everything was storybook perfect in the beginning and then everything went sour all of the sudden. All of us. And here's why: Nothing is ever storybook perfect. You click with someone, you have great chemistry, great. But then you need to hold back and learn about each other's values, about each other's tendencies, about each other's lives to determine if it really aut to be as serious as you feel it should be. And then you have to maintain it. Nothing goes smoothly without regular maintenence. So many people don't bother to look below the surface. Now, I'm not saying put your prospective partner through a series of tests, that is too calculated a move for love. But for goodness sake, if you're into someone who likes to live on a farm and you yourself are a city dweller for life, consider that one of these days, you'll need to compromise. if you can never see yourself going for that compromise, perhaps that person isnt' for you. Better to realize that before you become too invested.
Because here's what happens when you're too invested, and all of the sudden you realize you're into someone who doesn't share your ideals. Devistation. Disappointment. Fear. Loss. And everything in between. Granted, you can't figure out all there is to figure out about anyone. That would be boring and shallow, and not worth anyone's while if everyone new everyone else in a flash.
But you need to have a firm grasp on what you'll sacrifice or acquiesse to, because everyone is his or her own person. No one is exactly alike and so in order for a relationship to work, there has to be a bit of compromise. You have to create a whole other entity of sorts, all without giving up your own individuality. I really think that's the key here. I think you're in the best type of relationship, you're with your best-suited partner if you feel that neither of you has stopped being their individual selves in order to make the relationship work. if you have to give up too much of who you are, if you can't feel like you are yourself, then you probably shouldn't be involved in that relationship.
So now, I have a contraversial theory. I think if divorce was a little harder to come by than it is these days, people would: A. Try to be more careful about who they marry. And B: Work harder on making the marriage last.
How many couples have ever started out with the best of intentions; The people swore they were right for each other, they were the greatest of couples, and then Poof! Bang! They split. Is the split always justified? No, I don't think so. I think the great couples who should have been, get so caught up in how perfect they are together to realize that every relationship has to go through it's struggles. Every relationship has it's little issues that crop up here and there, causing a strain, a difficult conversation, a fight or two. But who says that always means that you have to show your partner the door? unless of course, things get so out of control that the people involved forget why they got together in the first place. Communication and quality time as a couple are the key to keeping a relationship fresh and making it last. Even the best of couples can get off track. So yes. I don't think divorce or breaking up is always the answer, though so many people use it so often. This society treats getting married like getting a new computer. Here I go, buying this great new piece of technology; When I'm through with it, when it can't serve my needs anymore, no big deal, I'll just get rid of it and maybe get something new.
People aren't objects, and relationships aren't things that you can just pick up and put back on the shelf when you no longer want it. No one should stay in an unhappy relationship, but so many relationships get ruined from a lack of effort.
Soulmates can be created. And everyone does have the one they can make a relationship last with, its the person you won't tire of compromising with. it's the person whom you'll be willing to see through whatever changes that may take place. It's the person you're willing to confide in. The person you'll readily grow to love and respect. Love at first sight is bullshit. It's chemistry and lust at first sight, and they're powerful factors. But real love takes patience. it takes some turbulance, some turmoil as well as an abundance of joy and security. That's how I feel regarding this topic. So stop looking for your soulmate, create a partnership that you can later proudly say was your one. .
I do not believe in soulmates, nor do I believe in The One. There are no supernatural forces placed outside of planet Earth manufacturing perfect matches for every person born. If you can find somebody who not only will put up with your personality quirks and faults, but love you for them, that's not fate, that's luck. There's probably a lot of perfectly nice and acceptable people who may end up living lonely and isolated lives for perhaps being a little on the nondescript side when people are wanting thrills and intensity and perfection until the day they die. People need to approach love more realistic and forget idealism.
godzilla, I don't think anyone here is saying soul mates are predetermined by some higher power. I, for one, don't think they are, and agree with what write away said about the term simply meaning someone you connect with on a deep level. that's how I see it, at least.
While I agree with you to some degree, adventure is not a bad thing. Perfection shouldn't be the goal, but someone who's mundane and boring all the time isn't going to make themselves or anyone else happy. Relationships are as much about risk-taking and adventure as they are about communication and trust.
You and your partner can do your own divorce and not pay anything except court cost.
If you agree that you are no longer suited the worst thing is to fight to split. Just split in good grace.
To keep a relationship together I feel I've learned is that one person must feel they'd never do anything to the other they'd not do to themselves.
The left hand doesn't cut off the head while to body sleeps, nor does the head decide to bite of the left hand. If this happened the body is severely crippled or dies.
Getting married because you don't want to be alone or you need sex is the worst thing. Date a while, then if you marry hopefully it will last for a long time. Forever is a touch concept and only works when it does.
that's a good point you brought up about adventure. I get how an introvert wouldn't see the beauty in that, but couldn't imagine being that way myself. it really is one of the spices of life, both in relationships, and for oneself.
Is anybody anything all the time though? People are complex.
No, of course not. But you have to have some variety and adventure some of the time, or someone is going to eventually get bored. I don't think getting out there and being active every second of every waking hour is a good thing, either. So, in fact, if someone is everything all the time, this would be a clear indication for me to stay far away.
Me too. Smile.
It's good to get in to a routine of trying out new things, for sure.
So, I too do not believe in soul mates but beeing with that one person all your life I do believe it can happen if both of the partners want to work on the relationship. From what I have been through here lately, if you try to strip your partners individual-self away from them a relationship for all your life will not work. here is an example: if your partner is a geek, your atempting to strip the geek out of him, Cancel Christmas on that relationship because when changing something that is not harmless and is apart of someones character will backfire on a person. Just my 1 or 2 sence here to this post.
If you do not believe in the concept of soul mates, that says to me you have not found one. It's hard to believe in something you've never experienced. Just as you can love more than one person, there is no rule I know of preventing you from having more than one soul mate. After all, it is soul mate, not sole mate. Some believe you are actually a part of a soul school. That is, there are many people of either sex who may share your soul. It's an interesting concept. As, fairly late in my life, I've found a soul mate, I can swear they do exist. Before I met mine, I would have been skeptical, but now I know better. I've been in love, and also been married more than once. Those states do not necessarily correlate with finding a soul mate. It is hard to describe the difference between being deeply in love, and finding a soul mate. They aren't exactly the same thing, but one is permanent, the other may or may not be. It is true one must work at preserving love. However, the effort doesn't seem like work for a sol mate. You want to please them, they want to please you, you bend for each other and yet do not feel used or diminished. Looking for a soul mate is a waste, but if you happen to find one, you'll know it.
But why would one stay in a relationship where you feel used or diminished. that's no relationship to be in. You shouldn't have to work extra hard to maintain a good relationship, but it can be labeled as work nonetheless. It can be effortless, yet it's still work because you earn a great relationship from it.
I believe I have found my soul mate, but this person is not and will never be my significant other. She is my best friend of 8 years. I consider her my soul mate because we put up with each other's shit and never complain about it. One of us can criticize or offer advice to the other without being offensive or getting offended. We share many of the same values. We can go without talking to each other for a month or two and there'll be no awkwardness, resentment, or anger the next time we spend together. We have never had a serious fight or argument. She and I just get along so fabulously that I can see us growing into old ladies, drinking coffee and laughing together.
I don't think there will ever be a guy who gets me like she does, has as many things in common with me, or gets along with me like she does.
Also, I think marriage is a bunch of bullshit. It just does not work like it used to. This is because love came into the picture. i am not sure when, but when love became a part of marriage, it ruined it. Marriage was originally meant to be a business contract and nothing more. Some people would learn to love their spouses, others would not. Marriages were for convenience or necessity. Bringing love into the mix ruins the idea of the business contract because many people get married for love and the idea of marriage was not established so two people who loved each other could be together forever.
I guess it depends on your values and quite a few variables.
I think the deffinition of a soulmate is important to clarify before beginning a discussion of whether or not they are real/possible. I see a soulmate as someone who has a similar soul, a similar essence to you. That is, if you ar an "old soul" they are also an old soul. Meaning someone who is spiritually where you are spiritually, and to some extent emotionally, someone who resonates with you on a very deep level. You can take spiritual to mean whatever it means to you wwhich might include being of the same religious group or not, might mean holding similar spiritual beliefs without technically being the same religion, it might mean being on the same place in your reincarnation spiritual journey if you believe in that, or any other spiritual qualification of what you feel a soul is. I love many people who I know are at far different places on their spiritual journey than I am, who have souls, essences far different from mine. I like many people who, again, I do not feel have similar souls to me. We say a classmate, someone who is in our class, a workmate, someone who works in the same place or job as we do, a room mate or dorm mate in the same room or dorm, and so on. So, I consider a soulmate someone who is in the same frame of mind when it comes to spirituality or the same level of spiritual growth and development, witha similar essence, who they really truly are, beneath the physical the accademic and to some extent the emotional. I am the first one to go nuts on someone for expressing the idea that my guide dog is my friend, or that animals are comperable substitutes for children, however, oddly enough I do think that an animal can be a soulmate, have a similar soul, which is really strange. Dogs and other animals are certainly not like us physically, and while they are intelligent, they are different from us mentallly. Emotionally I think that animals are also different. They do experience some complex emotions and they are profound and deeply felt, but different from ours, not only in what motivates them, but also in terms of the actual sort of emotion they feel. But I do believe that animals and human beings have souls and that sometimes one makes a spiritual connection with an animal that would qualify as a soulmate. This is not to say that animals take the place of friends, romantic partners, children, etc, but that there can be a connection, different from and beyond a bond that may develop. I can't think of a person with whom I've had that sort of connection at this point in my life, but I can think of a dog. My second guide dog Drew was that for me. We thought differently, obviously, were physically different, even more obviously, and did share some similar emotions, as much as a dog and a person can share without engaging in wild personification. But, I felt like our souls had the same strengths and virtues and the same dents and dings in them, needed the same sorts of healing and repairs, and possessed the same wonderful qualities. I'm sure I'm not explaining this well. If one believes in either the buddhist or native american views of spirituality it might make sense, where the equal worth, but different nature of humans and animals that many native american traditions and beliefs express or the reincarnation framework that many buddhists subscribe to where souls can be reincarnated as humans or animals as they progress through multiple lives, and where reincarnation as an animal after being in a human existance may be either an elevation of spirit to an upper level or a downward movement to go back and learn another crucial spiritual lesson, or even a parallel movement. I'm sure there are also a few Christians, Jews maybe even a few Muslims, egnostics or atheists who get what I'm saying. I believe it's possible to like someone without loving them, this happens often, to be sexually attracted to someone without loving or even liking them, it happens, but for one's mental health it's best to avoid such relationships, even to love someone without liking them very much at times. I feel like one is quite likely to love their soul mate in some way, depending on the sort of relationship that brings one together with their soulmate, but both liking and or being attracted to the soulmate are optional, not allways the case. I would simplify it and say that people we have relationships with can be arranged in a Ven Diagram where each aspect of one's self, physical, intelectual, emotional and spiritual each get a sphere into which to classify people. Those we are sexually attracted to go in the physical circle, those we like are placed in the intelectual circle, people we love go into the emotional circle, and those we are spiritually drawn to, a soulmate are in the spiritual circle, and there are overlaps possible between any two, three or even between all four of these circles. I also think it's possible to be spiritually impacted by someone without being their soulmate, I.E. I am spiritually influenced by the leader of a really impactful seminar I attended, but this leader is not my soulmate. Similarly, there have been men I have been sexually attracted to that I didn't know, or even didn't like very much, and so they effected me in a physical way, biological response, but they were not anyone I had an actual physical relationship with. So, I think it's a very very complex and subjective issue. I do believe that there is "the one" for everyone in the world, but I also believe that often we don't find that person because logistically in a global population numbering in the billions with a huge geographic scope, we just might not ever happen to cross paths with them. If you grow up in France and the one you're supposed to be with is in Japan, or you grow up in the United States and the person you are meant to be with is in Egypt, then chances are you will never find them. Also, just because you don't meet "the one" doesn't mean that you won't find satasfying sexual relationships, emotionally fulfilling romantic relationships, enjoyable friendships and even possibly finding a similar soul. Those who believe in multiple lives would interject here that you only ever have one "the one" and that in some of your lives you two connect and in some you miss each other entirely. There is also a notion that we have a close circle of people meant to influence us that tend to remain around us as we progress through our different lives. For instance the meaningful beings in your life in this life, say your husband, children, parents, best friends, very close mentors, guide dog and that one special horse might be a whole other cast of players in your next life. Your guide dog might now be your sister, your husband your friend, your mother your mentor, your mentor your brother and so on. And the relationships may be even more strange than that. For instance, someone you wronged, hurt or even murdered in one life may come back as your parent or child in the next, or something like that. Just throwing schools of thought out there and applying them to the issue at hand. I hope all of this makes sense. I think the post about love ruening marriage is really sick. I'm sorry but statements like that make me heartsick, and make me worry very much about the world we live in. The importance of love in a marriage has always been a factor, although how much weight it was given, whose love and happiness mattered more sociologicallly, the mans or the woman's or both, have changed over time, but even ancient cultures echnowledge that love is an element. What has ruened marriages is taking the falling in love experience to mean love it's self, and the mistaking of lust for love in some instances. Also, yes, a lasting relationship is hard work. Everyone brings bagage to a relationship and both partners have to work through the related issues. This may mean helping the partner by sharing some of the burdin of an issue they brought to the marriage, or it can mean supporting th
or it can mean supporting them while they work through their own issue. Even if there is a very real emotional connection, if there truly is love in the marriage, it does take concerted work on both people's part. Marrying someone who has a disability, who has been through trauma, who came from a different cultural background, who has had a whole plethora of positive and negative life changing experiences different from their partner makes this statement true. The idea that if it's really a good relationship it doesn't require hard work, or the work will feel effortless, is just not true. It will mean work, real, noticeable, sometimes unpleasant work, but it can be very worth it.
Wow, what a wonderfully and interesting take on the idea of soul mates, regarding the last post. I've never thought of it in that context, but I certainly do believe that dogs and other animals have souls, and I can see how they can be a human's soul mate. I certainly agree about the last bit that it does take work, and noticeable work to make a romantic partnership, a marriage last and be worthwhile.
I feel unsettled by the poster who says that love ruins marriage. What an unhealthy perspective, and how sad. I think, as I may have said in an earlier post, that people take the idea of love very lightly and they interpret many different things as love, which may not be so. For instance, lust is not love, strong infatuation is not love. Love takes a while to develop, and so I don't believe in love at first sight. I believe in instant lust and an instant emotional connection, and that can be a good precursor to love, but I'm not so foolish as to say that I love someone whom I met a minute or five ago. To do so would be to undermine love and its potential. I think it's romantic to say that you've loved someone from the moment you met them if you've been together for a long time and you want to sound passionate, but that doesn't necessarily make it technically factual. You may very well feel like that's true if you've loved that person for a long time and it's been a positive experience. But you're less likely to say you've loved someone from the moment you met them if they have wronged you in some way or if the relationship didn't turn out as you hoped it would.
Compatibility and communication is shoved aside in favor of lust and instantaneous infatuation. Then boredom and laziness, and possibly confusion take over. And that, my friends, is what ruins marriage. Not love.
love ruins marriage? that has to be one of the most idiotic things I've read in awhile. cause, actually, love is one of the crucial parts of a healthy, grounded marriage.
while I believe animals have feelings, I certainly wouldn't go so far as to say they can be humans soul mates. that's a little too far for me.
I'd have to agree. Humans and animals are different. I couldn't get my head around being a soul mate to an animal.
I'm not eeven sure the feelings we perceive as feelings are such. Maybe it is what we think animals think that causes them to have human feelings.
I tend to see it as more of a reaction. You treat an animal kind, or some anyway, you receive that kindness back.
If animals have feelings how do you explain owning a tiger from birth, treating it good, and loving it, but soon as it grows big enough it will, and in history, has killed its owners.
The feelings it has are reaction or nature.
A good example of that was a woman trainer that disobeyed the rules of training because she loved her lepard. She enter has cage while on her period. This was a no, no, because when the big cat smelled blood he got excited and it was dinner time, not love time.
She died because she felt close to her cat.
Another man owned a big monkey or some kind. He was told never to go in the cage at feeding time or mating time. He disobeyed that, and his monkey slammed him to death.
At Sea World in California, they've got this big whale. She has killed a couple trainers simply because she's really big and gets to playful. The trainers get to relaxed, and she's 800 pounds or more of fish.
No, I can't see that soul mate and animals at all, or even feelings.
Agreed with the last two posters. Though I do like animals, I can't compare them to the people who I genuinely care about the most.
I think love at first sight is a bunch of bullcrap also...
First of all whales aren't fish, secondly an orka is going to weigh upwards of two tons which is around 4000 pounds. Next, animals have instincts and animals are not humans, their feelings and thoughts are different from ours. This does not mean that they don't feel, or that they don't have some of the same sorts of emotions as we do, but they are felt and experienced and expressed differently. Not every species is capable of developing a strong bond with humans, or developing a bond sufficent to overcome instinct. Humans are just so different that there are limits. The examples you give are all different. As for the orka, if a trainer is injured or hurt because the animal is just too big and the trainer was not causcious this does not mean that the animal doesn't care for the trainer. Orkas have actively saved humans in captivity and in the wild. Also, humans are most often injured by captive orkas because they wind up pressing the trainer against some feature of the tank, which doesn't happen in the wild. I know of an orka whose trainer had a heart attack. The orka got them out of the water and put them on the platform but their face was in the water, so the orka leaned against the side and lifted the person up into a position where their nose and mouth were clear of the water. They began to vocalize frantically to try and get the attention of other trainers, not just making random noises but the sort of screaming and squeeling that most orkas only do when they are terrified or in great pain. This was caught on security cameras. When the trainer died the orka gave up and started this keening that is a clear sound of moarning, whales in the wild do it when one of their pod dies. They kept holding the trainer up, but they knew that they were dead. After other trainers arrived and took the body away the whale keened and carried on for several hours, then wouldn't eat for over a week, it lost over 100 pounds over that time and they were very worried about whether or not it would survive. Another orka who accidentally killed their trainer when they were swinging them in a circle, something the whale and trainer did for fun and as part of the show it kept nosing the trainer and also showed the moarning behaviors of the one I just described, and further, it managed to pull it's self out of the tank far enough to wind up dying. New tank designs have been changed because of this. It was clearly a beeching behavior, that sick or dying whales in the wild will engage in and that mothers have been seen to do after losing a calf to disease or attack by sharks. The orka was so upset that it's trainer had died, whether or not they realized that it was in part responsible and it literally killed it's self. Wild cats do sometimes hurt their trainers, and it is usually because of an instinctual trigger. When your dog gets a scent and goes after a squirl or a grey hound starts running or a horse is panicked and bolts, this doesn't mean that they don't care about you, but instincts are strong. The difference is that with a wild cat the teeth, strength, claws and power are so much greater than a house cat or a dog, but the basic principle is the same. In many cases people have been found dead in their house and their dog has starved to death or is very very malnourished and has not harmed the body, choosing not to eat someone they love, which is saying a lot when you consider that humans in starvation situations have engaged in canabolism through out history. Most notibly there was an instance where a woman's tiger got lose from it's cage, after the woman had already died of natural causes, and it ate the fish in the aquarium, caught and ate the house cat, ate garbage and food it could get out of the kitchen, but it never once touched her body and the cat was estimated to have lost over 30 pounds and to have been there unfed for about a week or so. That is impressive. Also there were signs that the tiger had been sleeping on the bed with the body, showing some degree of sadness or desire for lost closeness. A lioness who as a cub was nursed by a labrador retriever remained friends with the dog even when it was almost 10 times the size of the dog that once had been it's foster mom. This great big lioness would play extremely gently with the dog, would snuggle up to it and tried to share it's food with it as well. The dog's owners would bring it to the zoo to see the lioness frequently. One day when the lioness got into a bad fight with a male lion in a failed mating attempt, she was badly frightened, and she ran to the glass, to the dog, who had just arrived. She saught comfort from a creature who could no more protect her than a mouse could protect a cat from another cat. She ran to what she considered her mother. I am not arguing that dogs or any other animal are human beings, or that we should think of them or treat them as such, they are radically different, but they are capable of loving us, and I do believe that they have souls. A guide dog who does a trafic check to keep themself from getting hit just as much as their handler is acting out of instinct. The dog who barks frantically during a housefire beccause they want the hell out of there and it happens to wake up the family and thereby saves them is acting out of instinct, but dogs run into burning buildings to save people, dogs deffend their handlers, come back for them, put their own lives at risk when they have the option to flee. I am not making the arguement for the man who let his guide go in the world trade center and it came back to him, as that could be viewed as the dog returning because it was looking to him for dirrection. But, there have been instances where a dog bolts in instinctual fear from something, like a bomb blast, but stops themself and returns to save their owner. A dog in world war II stood by it's soldier handler for days after he had been injured and then died. Bombs went off all around them, well, shells, to be more accurate, and soldiers fired at the dog, but it wouldn't leave the body. Eventually soldiers had to drag the dog away, and the dog refused to eat and eventually died. So, yes, I do believe that dogs have souls. I think a human only ever seeking out animals to bond with is unhealthy, but if the person otherwise has healthy friend, family and romantic relationships, then I see nothing wrong with considering a dog their soulmate, as long as they are not just spouting sentemental gibberish without really thinking about it, and actually has a mentally healthy perspective about it.
To me anything that swims and has a fined tail is a fish. 800 pounds, because this one was just a baby. 4 tons of fish? If I couldn't ride it, I'm not going to try to out swim it. Imagine getting a love tap with a whales tail?
I stand on my reaction. The reason a dog doesn't eat the body is it probably doesn't understand the master is dead. I really think people give dogs the emotions they'd have themselves. Sort of like mentally casting a feeling on an animal.
Wayne, you completely underestimate the intelligence of an animal. Frankly, your statement that the dog doesn't understand the human is dead in the instance that it sits vigil by it's master's body is extremely ignorant. Clearly, you haven't spent enough time with a dog to understand how alert they can be. Dogs are masters of the study of body language; That's how they used to survive in the wild! If anything, the animal would recognize a dead body before another human would, just because of instinct. Also, The sent of a body changes once it is deceased, and a dog's sense of smell is about 200 thousand times stronger than that of a human. I can't begin to tell you how wrong you are. This is a prime example of someone talking out of his ass when he has no scientific evidence to back it up. Sensually just spent a good amount of effort to bring forth historical and scientific evidence to prove her point and you spew poorly thought out statements that you can't even back up. Please try to put some thought, effort and possibly a little research into your arguments, because that makes for intelligent debate.
To add to the comments of the last poster, there is a tendency to disregard or be skeptical of things one has not personally observed or experienced. I am not prepared to state categorically that love at first sight is impossible just because I've not actually experienced it. Though, I have to say, when my soul mate and I found one another, it was pretty close to a love at first sight experience. I have never experienced that sort of total connection before or since. No matter what one might label it, it was powerful, wonderful, and amazing in its strangeness.
To comment on an earliaer post: Though it is true that historically, marriages have often been business relationships, or arranged for political or economic reasons, to say that love ruins marriage is synical to the extreme. I'm sorry for a person with that view.
Wayne, you're absolutely wrong about a dog not being able to sense when a human is dead. Bernadetta already mentioned valid reasons why this is so, but I wanted to back her up.
Guess I should have stated it better.
Sure the dog know's the human is dead. What the dog doesn't know if it is alright to eat it.
The dog has been trained and kept by this person for a long time. It has been tought the human feeds it and does things for it.
Maybe it doesn't understand that that same human can not get up after being dead and feed it.
We are talking about a domestic animal, not a whild one.
No, I did not research scientific facts, however, a dog can and will never be a soul mate to me, nor any other type of animal.
Soul mate to me means as I have posted, and yes she does state it is not romantic. I can't and won't see a dog as being able to understand me well. A dog can not share my hopes, dreams, fears, and wants. No animal can do this.
I can see how some people think that way and even get to the point they have physical love with their animals, but I'm not one of them.
A animal, or some of them can be great companions, but understanding me, no.
Maybe I do talk out of my ass, but in this case I'll continue to be ignorant.
If animals are that smart, and can be soul mates why do they require to be cared for?
I have not experienced love at first sight, but the wife knew she wanted to be with me from the near moment she saw me, so she said. And we are such opposites on so many levels, but I think you must have a certain mindset for something like that to work. It only works at the attraction sort of a stage though, I guess.
Most of religion and parapsychology, if not psychology, goes right past me though.
As to the animal things, I don't know. I don't bond very well with animals anyway, but that does not make me a insensitive or unkind person. When we've had them here I have done well by them as best I could. There are certain things I still don't get, though. So the dog would naturally know the owner was dead. We all know animals have feelings, even have the post-traumatic stress like returning veterans or abuse survivors.
But how are they enabled to cope with the situation? How long would it take, for instance, for the dog to figure out what dead really means? That their human copanion is no more, that there is no way to interact with them again?
I know my brother who is a marine biologist said what they do with the captive elephants is show them the one that died, and where it died, and allow them to spend time with it. To think that animals have many of the complicated emotions that people do, and we ourselves, at least many of us, don't fully understand that stuff, but without the mental firepower to cope with the situations and work it out for themselves, seems a bit off-putting, but perhaps I'm missing something here.
Ok, Wayne, I respect that you couldn't view a dog as someone or something who can be your soul mate. You view the word soul mate in the strictest sense of the phrase, so i see how you might feel that way. That's your oppinion and you have a right to it, as does Leo to his.
However, what you said about the dog not knowing if it's ok to eat his owner or whether he's dead, or if he's going to get up and feed him is, and I want to put this as nicely as possible, laughable. Animals are instinctual, therefore whild or domestic, they are capable of similar practices. So it makes sense that a dog must feel emotion to some capacity. Perhaps you, as a human couldn't relate to the dog on an emotional level, but it doesn't mean that the animal is incapable of feeling a range of emotions. If this weren't so, How then, do you explain pack loyalty among dogs and wolves, or even between a dog and his human master? Just because you don't recognize it as such, doesn't mean something isn't there. Dogs and other animals are capable of feeling a range of emotions, at least to a certain degree; You're right that they can't feel quite like we humans can, but nonetheless, they can experience emotion. there's plenty of scientific evidence all throughout history to back this up. You can't simply dispute or dismiss a proven fact just because you yourself dont' recognize it as something you can relate to on a personal or individual level.
How can a scientist, or anyone else for that matter judge emotion in an animal?
With people you can talk to them and get a sense of what they feel, but a dog can't tell you.
I'll not dispute what people think, however, if is difficult for me to conceive emotion. I'm still on the side of reaction.
The animals get along because they are not attacked. If aggression is shown, and the animals are wild it is a fight or flight situation.
We have that as well, and even in use I see that as reaction.
When I think of emotion I think of love, or a heart felt feeling. Grief, sadness, happiness, love, sexual need.
Reaction to me is hunger, protection, thirst, hot or cold. Even teaching, or mental training.
And yes I see soul mates in the strict, or romantic sense, so this is why I can't see animals being such.
Emotion and reaction go hand in hand. If a lion is hungry, it will become fierce and attack a food source. If a dog is sad, it will whine. If a cat feels threatened, it will hiss, and screech and attack.
One thing on animals I am confident of, having raised birds. Due to the risks associated, they won't let you know when they're sick. You have to be paying close attention. They deliberately hide it as a sign of weakness: it's a jungle thing, and there's nothing you can do about changing that. All you can do is be vigilant when it comes to their health concerns. You could not explain to them that it is a safe place for them to divulge perceived weakness, and not get eaten. That is of course their emotions but unlike humans they cannot be taught differently. At least with birds, we were just always vigilant.
Hello:
So I do actually think there is a such thing as a soulmate, however, unlike most people I feel that perhaps it is best if your soulmate is someone you should never date. Your soulmate is someone who will be there for you no matter what. They will connect with you, totally get you. They are your friend till the end, stick with you through thick and thin, but because of that, they very well may be too much like you, therefore, I, personally, don't think I could be able to date my soulmate. I don't know if I agree if we could have more than one soulmate as I haven't exactly found mine, but it would I suppose make sense that you could have more than one soulmate. I just feel however, that the relationship aspect would mess the delicate balance up if you dated your soulmate, but this is just my oppinion.
Though I respect your view, my experience is different. My soul mate is my best friend, always has my back etc. She is also my lover, and that has made us closer. Though we have a lot in common, we are not just alike as you mentioned.
Agree with the last post. As I said, good communication is key, among other factors.
Good communication, yes, and a healthy respect for one another's differences. Some marriage writer in the early 2000s wrote that the same things that drive you nuts now are the same things that made you fall in love with the person to begin with.
More truth than fiction, and then we come to not blame the other but just respect and, dare I say, appreciate, the differences.
Leo, that is so true. there's some things that drive me a little nuts about my partner once in a great while, but I think back to the beginning of the beginning and how some of those things were endearing or even funny then. And I dont' kid you that a little trip down memory lane reminds me that these things are still endearing, or at least should be appreciated. It's always helpful and necessary to remember that your partner is his or her own person first, and that their various unique habits and pet peeves, routines, etc. are the very things that make up the person you love. It's the little things that can make or break a good relationship. You need to take some things lightly and with some humor, and be honest at all times. I dont' exaggerate about that; I guess it's ok to fib once in a while when a surprise is due and honesty would spoil it, or something of that sort. But any otherkind of lie only gets you into trouble, no matter how good of an idea it seems at the time.
I think, soulmate could be different from the one that you eventually may end up with, or the one you may date. I know as the fact that there's someone here that i would clearly consider as my soul mate, are we in a relationship? probably not. I think, a soul mate is someone that you will turn to, in good time, bad time, best time, and worse time. A person that you know will be there for you in stormmy day, rainny day, or sunny day. Someone will be there for you forever.
When I think of soulmate, I think of my best friend Nick. We're not dating, but sometimes he's the only person that understands me. I don't have to explain myself usually even if what I'm saying comes out jumbled to my own ears. Also, he doesn't make me feel too bad when I'm being immature about something. It's just nice. If you can find someone who does all that and who loves you, you're lucky.